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My Troll Invasion August 14, 2007

Posted by angryscientist in Feminism, Uncategorized.
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This entry is for the trolls to sound off, explain what makes them tick, why they do what they do, if they can write something with actual content possible to discuss. I’m including a couple of examples from hostile commenters. From my limited understanding, the trolls call themselves the Legion, the followers of lulz, who choose to attack certain web sites and blogs for reasons I wish to explore, since in my eyes these guys have a real problem with radfems, and a minor one with me. I got lots of subtle hate porn story spam, but no threats like what these raeped women are getting. The Obvious Troll sent me lots of crap in the initial invasion, but the level of threat of his “Eat shit and die traitor” doesn’t come close to what they throw at women. Most of my new visitors come from a Wikipedia spoof site with particular venom toward feminazis like Heart and her friends.

Note, if you find or know of that site, it mentions sites shut down by this lulz crew. It had precise instructions on how to shut down each target, since deleted. A publicly hosted blog is a harder nut to crack, though they could still make a blog exceed its traffic limit, unless the blog host is protected. I’ll miss reading the womensspace board, though I have to say, that was a space where what men would think didn’t seem to stop those women from saying anything. I have no idea what they were saying in private, though I did read a few allusions to forums not open to the public. It’s all closed down now, and I doubt it will come back as a board the public, or I, can read. Great victory? What was that about freedom of speech? My part in this is peripheral. Evidently a mother’s post about frustration with her teenage son’s propensities got taken way out of proportion and context, as an excuse to locate her and torture her with threats, in an epic battle with feminazis. One issue they seem to think works only in their favor is freedom of speech, deliberately suppressed by lulz. I’d be interested in any explanation of why a self-respecting man would stoop to such tactics preventing women from having their say in a safe space. For this particular blog entry, I’m suspending most of my rules. What is the harm in women talking freely? Do they shut you down? What is wrong with this picture, guys? The truth you can play fast and loose, laughing all the way, but it’s not on your side here!

You must think I’m totally off my rocker, huh? If a man had a teenage son who told him to fuck off and die, is there any man who might not think, I wish I hadn’t fathered this boy? That mother loves her son, despite major issues with the father. Humans have this faculty called better judgment that can prevent them from acting on harsh feelings. She is alarmed at her son’s behavior. Maybe you think it’s no big deal that young teens get to view what is supposed to be adult material. If she didn’t intervene, she might be charged with contributing to the delinquency of a minor, in some states. Am I mistaken? A mother can’t win, as usual. Whether she lets her adolescent son view adult material or tries to stop him, she is a bad mother in the eyes of the law or this strange gang, if not both. I don’t get why this gang isn’t trying to change the law if they care so much about a mother trying to stop her son from breaking it. Where is the beef? The beef seems to be with the law defining adult material off limits for children, but the mother gets death threats. This doesn’t compute to me. Explain. I’m dead serious. I want to know why a gang of men is picking on this particular mother. Tell me how what she said is worse than how you would react if your son told you to fuck off and die. Maybe this son didn’t use those exact words, but think about it. What would be going through your mind?

She didn’t specify what kind of porn she caught her son viewing, or if he got his hands on a credit card. We all know there is wide variety in what is called porn. Some of what is called porn is just plain nudity, which if portrayed artistically might not bother a feminist. On the other end of the spectrum is sexualizing women getting hurt, more or less. Rape, snuff, S/M, lots of variety, but the principle is not about sex, it’s about men dominating and/or hurting women. That may seem harmless to men, but I’m old enough to remember before Hustler came on the scene and busted all the rules, so men could take desperate women on a sleigh ride, paying them money to submit to torture. I don’t know what was on the black market, but Hustler broke the ground for normalizing sexualizing men’s vicious feelings towards women. I know, most guys think this is harmless, but I have to disagree. Women are raped, battered, harassed, terrorized, or worse on a routine basis. This society is in big trouble for lots of reasons, but one is its acceptance of such vicious feelings as normal for males. I’ve got nothing against male lust for women expressed appropriately, though it isn’t a casual thing for me. Humans also have this faculty called imagination. A normal straight male libido is not dependent on degrading women. Guys who try harder find out, sex can be be fun for women too.

Before my minor slice of troll invasion, I got this comment buried in Akismet from Anonymous at ebaums world. I decided to rescue it, because it raises a point I’m curious about.

Heart is a moron who blames problems on arbitrary stuff, just like any racist or bigot.

I don’t see why somebody like you supports her.

Somebody like me, meaning what? A man? A scientist, perhaps, who specializes in a branch of logic? I disagree heartily with this characterization. What men do to women is not arbitrary stuff. Heart knows not all men are like the lulz legion or get off on hurting women. Heart lets me comment on her blog, sometimes. One comment got me deigned a challenger to lulz, thus fair game. I recognized one troll from lurking at another board long defunct. Sorry, guys, to get on my blog you have to raise some issue, like the above, calling Heart moronic. Is that a reason to crash her site? What is the reason? I’m asking for an explanation, if you are reading here still thinking how to torpedo me for sticking up for her right to get her ideas out. She may make you mad as hell, but that’s no excuse for this dishonorable gangpile behavior. Is this done to everyone who expresses views that piss you guys off, or only if they appear to lack power to retaliate? High tech gang rape, no? Yes, the lulz gang openly recommends rape or raep of its declared enemies.

Why? What does it benefit you, to shut down discourse? Or is all a big joke, temporary amusement? I’d like to know, because I don’t get the joke. Is threatening rape and murder funny? It is criminal, by the way, anonymous or not. What’s so horrible about a mother regretting a child, when her feelings for him clearly outweighed her frustration? Her son is not in any danger because of her frustration. Can she say the same? What’s the reason for torturing her? Laughs? Why is this funny? I don’t get it. Why is she fair game for torture, because she fears her son will learn women are fair game to rape, batter, humiliate? Is that not what most porn is all about these days?

Is this an epic witch hunt, or a warning? I understand why men might want to satirize Heart, since she is running for President, but why these foul threats? And why pick on her friends? I understand this is part of a long-running campaign against women bloggers. Correct me if I am wrong. Most movements have factions, hangers-on, rogues, intrigues perturbing their common purposes. I don’t get what the gang is after with this rescuing the brother business. Her son should learn the truth about his mother being so distraught over his defiance of her that she wrote about it, and how he was conceived, and that she sometimes has wished he hadn’t been born? Why is it anybody’s business? That’d be hard on her and her son, but not as hard as if some anonymous guy pops up and tells him lies or wild exaggerations about it. He can rebel against his mother without any help. Where is the need or right to intervene? Nonexistent, but somehow that doesn’t matter, the lost brother must be rescued. You expect me to be on the side of that? Illogical mania based on deliberate distortion? Give it up guys, you’re making all men look really bad. If you want a fight, fight with me, with actual content, not wasting bandwidth with silly stories or poetry by someone calling himself Stalin. I believe in free speech. I have to object when I see it getting squashed. I object to any kind of thought police. I also object to the views of the inventor of that word, feminazi. I disagree with Rush Limbaugh just about 100%, but you don’t see me trying to shut him down.

This comment was posted on womensspace:

on 10 Aug 2007 at 6:19 am

91 Neuromancer

I can scarecly believe it. You’ve been given everything. EVERYTHING. And you still think that this is about feminism. Open your eyes for fuck’s sake, just close your mouth and pay attention. It’s not that hard. It’s like you willfully ignore information that contradicts your preconceptions. You can’t be that obtuse, noone is.

Yes, heart, I know you’re not going to post this, I wrote it in the off chance that you would let a differing opinion in. This isn’t about you, and it never really was, you should know that. Just lie low and it’ll blow over in a couple of days. Bring your website back up and start where you left off. Noone’s going to come after you, we don’t care. Radical opinion is necessary in any society, as it keeps it fresh and healthy, and the world knows that the american empire needs that now more than ever. I don’t agree with a thing you say, but that doesn’t mean that I want to stop you from saying it.

Is this true of more than Neuromancer? Is the lulz gang just sending a message, blowing off steam until it gets bored? Or is it determined to pursue a war to silence radfems? I know a bunch of you lulz guys have visited here. Sound off! What’s motivating you? Why are you picking on these women, really? Isn’t your real beef with the law, or the empire? What do you intend to do to them? Where do you draw the line? What does freedom of speech mean to you? How is it compatible with threats?

ETA: Follow the links of the commenters at your own risk.

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Comments»

1. Anon - August 14, 2007

WE JUST WANTS MORE LULZ AND LESS LOLCOWS

2. Anonymous - August 14, 2007

> Is this true of more than Neuromancer?
all of us, for we are legion (lol, hivemind).

> Is the lulz gang (wtf? It’s Anonymous you git) just sending a
> message, blowing off steam until it gets bored?
blow, lul.

> Or is it determined to pursue a war to silence radfems?
whores need to stfu and gb2/kitchen/

> I know a bunch of you lulz guys have visited here. Sound off!
I herd u leik mudkips.

> What’s motivating you?
popcorn

> Why are you picking on these women, really?
ok… buttered popcorn

> Isn’t your real beef with the law, or the empire?
dude, Empire kicks ass. The rebels can suck on it.

> What do you intend to do to them?
Stick in the thar poopers

> Where do you draw the line?
—————————————————

> What does freedom of speech mean to you?
words

> How is it compatible with threats?
nasty words… or bees, yeah fucking bees.

3. Anonymous - August 15, 2007

We do it for the funnies, do not only think we are only attacking you feminazi’s, at this point in time, Anonymous forces are fighting many front’s against the feminazi’s, Racists, Emo’s, Youtube fags, anyone who takes the internet as serious buisness, is a prime target for the funnies.

why are we attacking people not related to what’s her face moron, because instead of using a sniper to take out the threat like the police or military, we use a nuke…. in a city, more colatieral damage, the more lulz, as I said on another blog, you don’t see a action movie to see someone trip and fall, you see it for massive explosions and people being blown up.

Oh we are also doing this because the feminist movement is full of lulz, like seriously, this patriarch thing has been eliminated in every major way in the past 10 years and if men do anything these day’s that a women disagree’s with, she calls the cops makes some story up about rape and the male get’s the IRL ban hammer, even if said female dosn’t provide proof, a female “Victim’s” words hold alot more sway than that potential male “Rapist”, and even if he dosn’t get convicted, chances are his social rep is already ruined and will not be thought of as a innocent man convicted wrongly of rape, he will be thought of as that “Guy who got away with raping a chick”, and don’t even get me started on custody trials, man loses his kids, half the stuff he probably paid for, then has to pay for the kid’s despite he can only see them once a month, wtfits, the pay gap between men and women can be explained that Men often take high risk, high paying jobs, while most women take desk jobs with medicore wage, also in your average sitcom, the male is usually your lazy douchebag idiot while the woman is always the voice of reason.

So instead of complaining, do something constructive and bake your man a delicious cake, then give him some good loving.

(Edited to remove name)

4. FemAnon - August 15, 2007

MOAR LULZ.

(Not all of us are male.)

5. angryscientist - August 15, 2007

Here’s one from the original troll invasion:

Delicious CopyPasta | ie@gmail.com | ebaumsworld.com | IP: 24.96.46.232

I try to ply one of my female friends into sexual situations almost every time I see her. It’s a bit of a game. She initially refuses, but when she gets horny due to my sneaky groping tricks I can usually have my wicked way with her to some extent.

If I’m a rapist because of this, then rape is awesome.

Not Spam – Aug 6, 9:52 AM

Rape implies the woman is an unwilling participant. Since your friend still seems to like you and allows you to get away with this, maybe she thinks it’s all good fun. If so, it isn’t rape. Rape is not a game.

6. angryscientist - August 15, 2007

Regarding comment 3, what planet are you living on? A rape victim’s words carry more weight than a rapist’s? Since when? Most women don’t bother reporting rape because conviction is so rare. You men’s rights defenders really ought to get your facts straight, but I’m not holding my breath for that. “This patriarch thing has been eliminated in every major way in the past 10 years?” Yeah, sure it has. If you believe that, I have a bridge to sell you.

7. Anonymous Supporter - August 15, 2007

What planet are we on?

Earth. In the USA.

Tawana Brawley?

Duke Lacrosse guys?

Its not mens rights here…its the huge amount of rights women have OVER men, or the establishment of a Matriarchy with people like you propping it up. What we have is where women are not only going to college more than men, they’re given automatically more seats then men.

Pay? As dude said, men not only take the more ‘suffering’ type jobs (whereas women as a majority will state they want more time, men will want more money). That, and women still can’t hold some jobs – being infantry or anything that will be on the frontlines (artillery, any Special Forces, etc) is still barred (in Iraq, women die because the line is all over).

And you sir, TOTALLY MISSED what Heart and company said. I literally cannot believe that you are diminuitizing what she said. No, we are NOT blowing it out of proportion. More like its a shame a sane society hasn’t already ostracized her. Kid shoulda died first because he was a boy but now should REALLY die because he’s gonna somehow abuse women? Fetuses are parasites? WHAT THE HELL IS SHE DOING WITH CHILDREN?! Oh wait – you’re a supposed scientist? I forgot how much you idiots lap this stuff up. I forgot who did say it, but he said being a scientist, he was wholly convinced that unless restrained, many scientists would use humans as guinea pigs. Makes sense. After all, fetuses DON’T give anything back to their mother, errr host. Totally scientific way of looking at it – no morals.

The Patriarchy is pretty much dead. You radfems just see what you want to see now, attack what you think exists. The hard truth is women 99+% of the time get the kids in a custody battle, and the woman just usually ends up poisoning the kids minds. This is not some diatribe against women – I love my women, its just you radfems, you don’t want equality. You never did want equality. You want a Matriarchy. If you haven’t noticed, much of Anonymous is Female – maybe that says something?

8. angryscientist - August 16, 2007

Oh brother. Typical men’s rights argument. Do you guys actually believe this malarkey?

I remember Tom Leykis arguing fetuses are parasites almost 20 years ago. It’s not a new idea. I don’t know who invented it, but it’s not owned by radfems. Whoever said anything about the kid should die? You’re making that up. The mother merely wished she’d had an abortion. Maybe that was an overreaction, but as I stated, the boy is in no danger from her whatsoever. Whatever danger you perceive is all in your head. You people have whipped yourselves up into a frenzy for nothing. I think comment 3 says it all, “anyone who takes the internet as serious buisness, is a prime target for the funnies.”

As for the Duke lacrosse players, who gave the woman more credibility than the men she accused, besides the disgraced prosecutor? Their reputation is just fine, except among feminists. Most people believed all along they were wrongly accused. Talk show hosts ranted about that day after day.

Women have rights over men? Such as? Women usually get custody of kids when the father doesn’t contest it. When he does, it’s a different story. 99%+? Hard truth? It’s hard not to LOL at that. Where did you get your stats?

Radfems aren’t interested in reversing roles. They want to scrap roles. Big difference. If you call that matriarchy, you have no idea what the word means. The opposite of patriarchy has never existed and nobody wants it to. There is speculation about egalitarian matrilineal societies long ago, when a child’s paternity was often unknowable.

So, out of curiosity, how much of Anonymous is female? I doubt you have any idea. Anonymous doesn’t take a census, right?

One thing you said I wouldn’t dispute. Scientists are indeed using humans as guinea pigs.

9. FemAnon - August 16, 2007

Lol, copypasta.

How much of Anonymous is female? I saw a 20% figure once…but it would probably depend on the chan, the topic, and who felt like telling the truth that day.

10. MrOni - August 18, 2007

You sir are a fag. That or you like large ugly women to do things to you. The natural order of things is that women are under men this has always been so. Name a matriarchy that has ever worked. Oh you can’t can you? These bitches say some stupid things that they put up on the internet they are liable to be attacked for saying them. Do you realise that this mother’s son is being oppressed for trying to wack? Now how would you feel?

Edited to remove name

11. angryscientist - August 18, 2007

MrOni, like some other commenters here, seems to have trouble with the truth. Every one of his statements is untrue, irrelevant, or both. If he’d bothered to read elsewhere on this blog, he’d know I am a straight guy and not kinky. As I just stated above, the opposite of patriarchy has never existed and nobody wants it to. Many men can’t conceive there might be an alternative to one sex dominating the other. The son in question isn’t being oppressed by his mother, but his father is another story. Do you think required reading in school is oppressive? Do you think there’s any point in defining adult material? Should everything be available to everyone regardless of age or content? The mother wasn’t objecting to her son masturbating. The problem is the means he chooses. Have you no imagination, no capacity for arousal without crude artificial stimulation? If so, you aren’t human.

There’s also a huge difference between attacking arguably stupid things people say on the Internet and issuing swarms of death threats and/or overloading their accounts to silence them. Nobody objects to rational debate. I’ve approved this last comment even though I find it gratuitously insulting and disagree with everything he says. It’s not what I’d consider much of a contribution to rational debate, but at least it has some content and no threats. Other bloggers may not want to waste their time with silly insults or similar BS; that’s their prerogative.

I have to say, even given such a small sample as I’ve seen so far, that in my estimation Anonymous is far from a hive mind. Since they seem fond of throwing around that feminazi word, I wonder how many fancy themselves Rush Limbaugh dittoheads. I wonder what bonds them together, since it doesn’t seem to be shared beliefs.

12. MrOni - August 19, 2007

It hasen’t existed because oh I don’t know maybe women are not susposed to fight. They are phsyically weaker and thus if they ever formed a society they could not defend it. Now good sir how do you wack without artificial stimulation??? Wtf I guess if you wanted to walk around with blue balls until you had a wet dream or something. A 13 year old boy should have access at least to playboy and tame stuff like that. It’s only natural he needs to wack. Girls that like showing off their bodies must offend feminazis very much usually because they are ugly old broads or in this mother’s case she married the wrong guy. Anonymous has no political motives anonymous is anonymous. If you get mad about what anonymous writes you are just feeding it.

Edited to remove name

13. angryscientist - August 20, 2007

Men on average have an edge in upper-body strength, but women are quite capable of fighting, despite all the messages society throws at them to discourage them from learning how to fight. Besides, in this day and age, brute strength has virtually nothing to do with defending a society. Besides, the reason no reverse of patriarchy has ever existed has far less to do with lack of opportunity than women’s lack of desire to wield that kind of power over men.

I said, crude artificial stimulation. Maybe most males lack imagination, so think they require visual aids, but combining a fantasy with some means of friction works fine for me, and when I was young I was so horny I didn’t even need to fantasize. Also, there are erotic works of art and literature, or didn’t you know? At least you seem to be conceding some material maybe shouldn’t be available to teenagers. The boy has been surfing Internet porn for over a year. What are the odds he’s only been looking at tame stuff? Pretty poor, I’d say.

No political motives? Could have fooled me. What do you call shutting down feminist discussion, apolitical funnies? Be that as it may, you guys really ought to give this mother a break. If you think porn should be available to teenagers, even just tame stuff, you have a beef with the law. Why are you picking on her for obeying the law? Because she has some regrets about not having an abortion after the father raped her? That was obviously an emotional reaction to feeling her son is lost to her, the father has won. That feeling is tempered by her better judgment. She doesn’t want to give up on him, and certainly doesn’t intend anything to hurt him. She’s been trying to protect him from his abusive father, feeling guilty she didn’t get in the way of more blows directed at the boy! Give her a break! You guys have made your point. She isn’t posting in public any more, now is she? Why can’t you say, she’s been tortured enough, and leave her alone? If you guys should be mad at anyone for hurting that boy, you should be mad at the boy’s father and/or the law! If you think this is me getting mad, you haven’t seen anything yet!

And by the way, most porn is not showcasing girls who like to show off their bodies, but women desperate to survive, and/or sold a bill of goods about what they’ll be asked to do. There aren’t nearly enough exhibitionistic women to account for all the porn, not even close. Most women in porn hate what they have to do, but feel they have no good alternative.

Isn’t it interesting how almost all of my questions have been ignored?

14. Anonymous - August 21, 2007

I remember the time when women were stading in the kitchen all day long and took care of the children.

When the man came home, his wife would serve him a good meal and have sex with him.

If all the women chould do that for their husband, the world would be perfect.
I mean, come on! Women exist to serve the man, and if she don’t, just slap her in the face!

That’s how I do to MY happy wife!

15. Anonymous - August 22, 2007

“Men on average have an edge in upper-body strength, but women are quite capable of fighting”

False. I tried to start a fight with a girl. She screamed and ran away like the little bitch she is. Started a fight with her boyfriend. Fuck that was a good fight.

16. Anon - August 22, 2007

We do it because they react to our harassment.
If they simply moved to private forums without going crazy over what’s happened we would leave them alone.
Maybe if the world was fair they shouldn’t be forced to ignore it, but If that were the case there would be no need for feminist (activists).

But they go off about how it’s some conspiracy to shut them down because they can’t comprehend that their ideals are of no importance whatsoever to us.
We’d be attacking them just as much if they were a mens rights group/ black rights/ world of warcraft fans/ second life players/ deviant art users/ Livejournal users/ Muslims/Christians/ Wiccans/ 14 year old girls/ pro-anna groups/ gangsta forums/ whatever, hell we even attack random school websites and their forums (All things mentioned have been the target of raids). As long as someone gives us this much fun when as this when attack, we will troll them.
And as a matter of fact, after we’re bored of this raid, there are already plans to attack anti-feminist groups.
If they prove to be just as bad at handling trolling as these feminist groups are I imagine it will get to the intensity of this attack too.

If you want this to stop the first step is recognize that whilst we may be attacking feminists at the moment, it has nothing to do with your beliefs.
Your community is just in our sights for the time being.
We happily harass anyone with any views from anywhere in the world as long as its funny.
Your beliefs are just as unimportant to us as what type of font you use on your blog.
Awhile ago we were people trying to subvert god’s will and the aryan race when we attacked racists, we were satanists when we harassed the Christians, we were hard-liner Christians when we attacked the atheists, and the pagan community just called us close minded us for awhile, but they smartened up pretty quickly, ignored the comments and the raid died down after a few days.

lulz, and the potential for lulz are the only, and I mean only, thing that we care about.
When you join legion you leave your beliefs at the door.
I recently helped attack and spam the ron paul wiki and supporters related sites, despite the fact that I support him.

Hell, quite often we harass people from our own group who carelessly give out too much of their own personal information.
Some of us even had to get hidden phone numbers. And they most defiantly had to abandon all and any other accounts they had, lest we find them again and the harassment starts over.

Our group is akin to an organized serial killer, and until your community accepts that, and abandons the belief that this is politically motivated, you’ll have no choice but to wait until we get bored, or push all of you into private forums and secret blog rings.

I might say, that this has already progressed far enough that it might be to late to slow it in any way (If I siad how, it would ruin the surprise).
However, people who aren’t already being targeted can simply avoid it by not mentioning these incidents in public.

17. Nick - August 23, 2007

I doubt you’re a scientist. You call us “men’s rights activists” but are we really? What rights do white men have? I have PERSONALLY SEEN a less-qualified individual get a job over me because of his color, but I was thankful because he had a family to feed and I didn’t. The principle still stands, though. Why should minorities and women suddenly get all the rights, as opposed to everyone being equal? At some point there HAS to be a cutoff, maybe not right now but soon, where the activists go away and nobody can cry race or gender.

And that shit with the porn? Please. I know plenty of working women. I know no porn stars. Hmm… No alternative? Worst argument ever.

And a rape “victim” CAN EASILY get somebody put away, it just depends on the jurisdiction. 🙂 Especially if it’s with a minor, and I’ve seen this one personally. I’ve lived this one because my girlfriend is underage and even though she wouldn’t, she still CAN. You don’t need evidence when it’s a “she said he said” thing because SHE WILL ALWAYS WIN. Custody battles are another thing, I know plenty of moms out there who are total fucks to their kids and don’t deserve them, yet their dad is paying child support. I don’t support Anonymous in hacking/spamming all of these boards but I DEFINITELY do not support your camp.

As it is, you’re going to dismiss my argument as “wah wah, ignorant” or some nonsensical bullshit and to be honest, I don’t care. I’ve said my peace, and I know what kind of life I live. I know what really goes on outside your little circlejerk communities and I know the gender roles being forced on ME because of the “women’s rights” movement that has ACCOMPLISHED ALL IT SET OUT TO DO. I fucking hate women, but I definitely won’t be caught discriminating against them because it’s wrong. I find a problem with it, and I realize they’re people to.

You know, bigots CAN keep their ideas to themselves. Some of us were raised to keep our negative comments out of public conversation unless people really want to know. You asked, pal.

18. angryscientist - August 24, 2007

Comments 14 and 16 were rescued from Akismet. Comment 16 is interesting. I wish I could believe him. He’s making a similar argument to Comment 3 and Neuromancer. I’m willing to consider the possibility that this latest campaign against feminist bloggers isn’t politically motivated, because I see my commenters saying things all over the map. Some obviously hate feminists with a passion. Others, it’s not so obvious. It’s hard to believe the main thing bonding Anonymous is their sense of humor, but maybe it is.

There’s obviously some kind of conspiracy going on to shut down Heart and her friends. Whether this is just a passing phase for Anonymous is open to question. Some of their rank may be getting bored already, while others are still bound and determined to keep the harassment going. Women may be more sensitive to this kind of harassment because so many have gone through real life episodes of rape and beatings. It’s unreasonable to expect them to take this lightly, even though that might well be the best way, to let Anonymous get bored by ignoring them.

It’s also clear that some of Anonymous either do care about what feminists believe, enough to want to silence them, or are very good at faking their hatred. Nick above, for instance, confesses he is a bigot who hates women. However, he also says he doesn’t support Anonymous, yet he refers to himself as one of “us” whom I called men’s rights activists. There are two fronts to these attacks, the foul threats and harassing comments, and the site overloading. I presume Anonymous is responsible for both, but I don’t have any way of knowing that. Men’s rights activists have been sending threatening comments to female bloggers for a long time, so their association with Anonymous may be loose, nonexistent, or a means of confusing their targets.

Enough speculation for now. Comments 14 and 15 are too ridiculous to merit a response. I’ll just reiterate, though women are discouraged from learning how to fight, some learn anyway and prove themselves quite capable. Nick, yes I did ask, but I was asking primarily to find out what makes Anonymous tick. I can’t decipher whether Nick is associated with them or not. Nevertheless, I’ll attempt to respond to Nick. It’s true some white men are as bad off as anyone, but it’s also true those in control of the Western world are overwhelmingly white men. Gender roles are most certainly not being forced on anyone by the women’s movement, which wants to scrap gender roles. Maybe Nick meant something else, such as being forced to obey the law against sexual harassment? The women’s rights movement has accomplished all it set out to do? Really! That’s news to me, most women, maybe everyone except men’s rights activists who feel so put upon by the gains women have made, threatened by male backlash on every front. Nick’s anecdotes mean nothing beyond his own experience. His doubt of my scientific background is laughable, considering how he seems to know so little about how anecdotal evidence and statistics get manipulated. There may be isolated instances of less qualified women or minority men getting preference over white men, but the opposite is commonplace, which is why laws and remedies against discrimination are necessary.

Rape victims will always win, even without evidence? I’m curious where Nick got that misinformation, and why he put victim in quotes. Does he prefer another word? Actually from what I read, most survivors of rape prefer to call themselves just that, survivors. Rape convictions are notoriously rare, which is one reason most rapes are never reported. Statutory rape is different in that respect, since there rarely is any dispute over the young woman’s age, which is all the law cares about when she is underage, since by definition, she cannot be a consenting adult.

19. Anon - August 26, 2007

Anon Is Chaotic Neutral, We destroy because we can. There is no other reason, it is funny to take the worst examples of Faggotry (I am a homosexual man and No I don’t have a issue with using that term, grow a pair, its a word.) and making a internet wide example of them. We may be wrong, we don’t give a damn. Anyone here applying reason to what we did is doing it after the fact and they don’t speak for anon.
I don’t speak for anon either, you can’t speak for anon. Anon does not speak he destroy.

20. thebewilderness - August 26, 2007

angryscientist,
I think you missed a key point in nick’s post. The person he claims to be having sex with is under the age of consent. Therefore he is engaging in a criminal act and will be found guilty if caught. He appears to be either a very young person having sex with another young person, or a pedophile.

21. angryscientist - August 27, 2007

Thebewilderness, thanks for stopping by. I’m not sure what you think I missed. Both Nick and I mentioned the illegality of statutory rape. He obviously doesn’t care about her being underage, but as I stated, that’s all the law on statutory rape cares about. I don’t think any of these commenters give a damn about the law, which is one reason I’m saying their real beef is with the law, not this mother they see fit to torture for laughs.

Comment 19 speaks for itself. I guess this is what the meaning of manhood has come to, destroying because they can. You guys really need to take a good hard look at yourselves. Clearly freedom of speech has no importance to you, since your need to revel in the lulz of destruction takes precedence. Where’s your sense of honor or fair play? What does manhood mean to you, the ability to destroy? Do you care at all about what this mindset is doing to the planet?

22. angryscientist - August 27, 2007

I sent the following e-mail to a local talk show host with a segment for reading a few on the air, after hearing Elton John said the world would be better off if the Internet ware shut down for five years.

Hi, Frank. This is (name), not sure if you remember me, but I’ve attended several of your lectures, though not lately. What Elton John said about shutting down the Internet is ironic in view of what’s going down at the moment. There’s an Internet gang calling itself Anonymous or Legion that sends death threats and shuts down web sites that offend them, for laughs. They call it lulz, plural for LOL. They think freedom of speech is a joke. This month they’re targeting feminist web sites. They say it’s nothing political, which has some credence since they’ve attacked a wide variety of sites, but currently they are focusing on a radical feminist blogger, screen name Heart, who’s running for President, and a bunch of her friends. If anyone wants to know more, check out my blog entry My Troll Invasion at angryscientist.wordpress.com, or Heart’s blog, womensspace.wordpress.com. They tried taking down her blog as well as her site, but WordPress is too big, so the blog has survived.

I think he must remember me. To my surprise, he read it verbatim, except to delete the sentence with (name), that for his info only, and Heart’s link. He affected not knowing LOL, guessed lots of luck? This host is a stickler for not giving free publicity, but he did give me some, about 4:30 this morning. I think he read it because he believes in freedom of speech. That’s what this is all about for me, as a man with unorthodox views, to say the least. Maybe I should use terms Legion might respect. They are engaging in unsportsmanlike conduct, flagrant personal fouls against women who just want to have their say. That kind of thing can get you suspended or banned in football, right? Let these women speak, I say. We have freedom of speech here. That still matters to me, regardless of my personal opinions of what they say. If people don’t like what they have to say, don’t read them. Vote for somebody else. Speak your own mind. If you have the numbers you think you do, you’ve nothing to worry about, right? If the Internet is just a game for you, play it fair! Let women have their say!

23. Anon - August 28, 2007

Manhood??????
This is juvenile vandalism, nothing remotely mature.
We are, most of us, under the age of seventeen.
We don’t care about your reasoning, we don’t care about your pleas, because, quite frankly, this isn’t real life, it’s the internet.
This is our entertainment, it’s like switching on the TV at the end of the day after homework is done.
It’s relaxing and funny.
Pretty much anything you hear or see us do is something that’s confined to this imaginary world.
You might see allot of death threats, but the fact of the matter is that no-one would even think of going through with them.
Furthermore, as Immature as we are in cyberspace, for the most part, we leave that behind when we go back to our lives.
Kind of like the separation between the real world and a movie you’re watching.
We can get into it, but we don’t take this stuff out to the rest of the world with us.

I’m sorry if you’d really like to believe that we’re just bad people through and through, who carry our cyber-actions/ mentality everywhere, but honestly, if I met you people in real life I’d be quite respectful and polite.

That, and I have no sympathy for Heart.
Reminds me of a fanatical Christian.
In fact, I’m pretty sure those types of people are quite interchangeable, their beliefs are just whatever happens to fit into place first.

24. angryscientist - August 29, 2007

Two more comments rescued from Akismet, the above and this one posted to my OJ Simpson entry:

OJ is a hero of our people, and that people is men. Men are the rightful rulers of this world, women are mere puppets for us to fuck. If it weren’t for that lukewarm hole in your crotch that you defend from us men so hard, and yet spread your legs as wide as they can go for any other “woman” that passes by, we’d have cast the lot of you off and really shown you what its like to be raped and beaten everyday. And this isn’t a threat this is a statement.

25. angryscientist - August 29, 2007

I’m really not sure why the OJ commenter uses the second person, unless he thinks I’m a woman. I’m not going to waste my time figuring out his nonsense. If it weren’t for my policy of letting just about anything through from Legion on this particular entry, I’d have deleted it along with the rest of the junk in Akismet.

The previous commenter is another I wish I could believe, though his estimation of Heart is absurd. Long ago, Heart was in the thrall of fundamentalism, though even then she was a rebel. Her eyes got opened wide by an attempt by people she trusted to shut down her magazine. She’s well aware of the trap of fanaticism. Having strong convictions doesn’t make anyone a fanatic.

Having said that, what he says may be true of him and many of his buddies, but it’s hard to believe nobody in Legion takes what they’re doing seriously. It appears to me that some are in it just for the lulz, while others mean business. Death threats aren’t funny, regardless of why they’re made or whether they’re merely idle fun to those making them. If I hear of Legion taking down sites of anti-feminist groups, I might be more inclined to believe it’s all just for fun.

26. Frontspace - August 30, 2007

Pre-Message: About women being raised not to fight, that’s BS. There’s women kicking ass all over mainstream media (Aliens is my favourite movie ever). Also: An asskicking warrior woman with a gun is one of the hottest things evar.

This amuses me because you are missing the point of these “attacks”. While certainly there are misogynistic internet users, these are in fact a minority. Many instances of racism and sexism on the internet are humour or trolling. Humour usually in the irony of playing up a negative stereotype, or at worst poor method of making fun of someone. Or trolling, which is a process of attracting attention and inciting arguments with outrageous statements the troll doesn’t actually believe.

Either way, this mass misogyny is a fabrication of skewed perception and negative stereotypes of men and internet users. The reason these attacks are taking place is because it’s funny. Because the people making these attacks are amused by the outraged and often misdirected response it generates (this article is a perfect example).

The attacks started because this mother said she wanted to abort her son for looking a pornography. Something considered perfectly normal and generally expected of teenage males by %95 of Western Society. Thusly, she was identified as someone who would likely produce lulz (a corroption of LOL, eg: entertainment). This was true, and it was also true of all the other radical feminists linked to her.

Now I am a male, and I am a feminist. I beleive in equal treatment for women. However, I also believe in the application of common sense and reason. Women are generally weaker then men, this isn’t misogyny it’s genetics. Just like often women are better at math and critical thinking then men are. Just like boys like robots and GI Joe while girls like Barbie and the colour pink. Its not all social engineering, its psychological and biological predisposition. What’s even funnier is that RadFeminists try and deny this common knowledge, while trying to paint men as evil beings doomed to rape every woman they know unless they are carefully trained. Like a fucking lion or something (which I as a male find offensive).

This is why I don’t like Radical Feminism. Often members fly in the face of this common knowledge, becoming outraged at everything that seems misogynistic. For example, in Canada (where I live) the standards for becoming a police officer or firefighter where lowered because many women complained it was too hard to get in. While a sexist policy I beleive is unfair, I also know that a cop should be able to chase and take down a criminal. That a firefighter should be able to carry an injured person out of a burning building and down a ladder. If you can’t do that, woman or man, you shouldn’t be a firefighter.

Now, in the case of this mother and her son, he was caught looking at pornography and she freaked out. Now if he was looking at hardcore bondage where a woman was theroughly beaten, I might be concerned. Probably, however, it’s safe to assume he was just looking at run of the mill sex on video pornography. This is not misogyny, this is the desire to see a naked woman. Men capable of breeding find women, the idea of having sex, attractive. Pornography and masturbation are a natural result of this desire, not of a deep seated hatred of women.

This is why Radical Feminists are being attacked. Their (as the name admits) radical beliefs clashed with that of the attackers, and they felt the boy was in the custody of someone unfit to raise him. This led to a lulzy response from her and other RadFemmes, which fed more attacks. This isn’t the work of a grand patriarchy. There is none. There aren’t powerful men all sitting in a room carefully figuring out how to engineer a woman hating society. There’s just a loose collection of people who are entertained by their actions being mentioned in articles like this.

Also, on the matter of the patriarchy, it doesn’t exist. Men dominate because that’s the way it worked 10,000 years ago. The woman made food and managed offspring while the man hunted and gathered. It’s the arrangment that worked, the one that insured humanities survival, and thus became hardcoded in our genetics and society. It’s not an excuse for sexism, just an explanation, and also a reason to chill the fuck out and let society evolve. It wont happen overnight, and pushing the issue as hard as RadFemmes do just casts a bad light on moderate feminists.

Anyways: If you want to stop the attacks, stop responding to them. Or better yet, grow some common sense and moderate your beliefs a bit.

(This was written for the article “Misogyny Bears its teethe on the internet” but is being posted on relevant blogs.)

Edited to remove names

27. angryscientist - August 30, 2007

Frontspace, since you’re primarily arguing with an article written 10 days ago for the Sydney Morning Herald, what I’ll say may not be terribly relevant. I can’t speak for radical feminists. I can only explain my own point of view.

You claim to be a feminist and believe in equal treatment for women. You demonstrate why some radfems say men can’t be feminists, since your rant is full of distortions and misinformation. You call it common sense. Your point of view may be common, but I’d dispute your claim to making sense. I’m sure you make perfect sense to those who agree with you, but even a broken clock is right twice a day.

It’s true nowadays there are kickass women in mainstream media, but girls still get plenty of messages to the effect they should be ladylike. If most girls learned martial arts, how much rape would go on? Some women do learn how to fight anyway, but they’re still a small minority. Racism and sexism are endemic in our culture, so it’s hard to credit your assertion misogynistic internet users are in the minority.

The mother in question didn’t say she wanted to abort her son for looking at pornography. She said she wished she had aborted him, before he was born. Since he was a result of rape, isn’t it logical that went through her mind at the time? Looking back, she feels some regret for not having done that. Lots of people have second thoughts about whether it would’ve been better if a particularly troublesome offspring hadn’t been born. Legion is promulgating the myth she’s contemplating murdering her son, so he needs to be rescued! This is reasoning twisted into a pretzel, not funny! Oh, I guess it’s funny to them.

If girls were encouraged to develop their musculature like boys are, the male edge in strength would become insignificant. The common theory is that women are better at verbal skills, not math. Not all girls like Barbie or pink, or dislike robots or other stereotypically male toys, though they are heavily socialized in that direction. What you call common knowledge is common, but it’s merely influential fallacious fantasy, not knowledge. Give me an example of one woman painting men as evil beings doomed to rape every woman they know unless they are carefully trained. Is that you trolling, making an outrageously exaggerated statement you don’t really believe? Also, your reference to lions is off base. Female animals are generally quite capable of defending themselves. In some species, the female is bigger and stronger than the male.

Your assumption as to what the boy was viewing is not at all clear. When I was growing up, pornography was relatively innocuous, but Hustler changed all that, and nowadays the crueler the imagery, the better it sells. Feminists are rightly alarmed by this trend, which has taken porn far beyond any conceivable rationale of natural desire.

There doesn’t have to be a gathering of powerful men to figure out how to engineer a woman-hating society. That was done thousands of years ago, and only recently have women won any rights at all. They had no more rights than black slaves when the United States was founded. In the sex trafficking business, women are still sold into slavery. Besides, women in primitive societies did most gathering and some hunting. The phenomenon of male dominance occurred later, has never worked well, and certainly played no part in insuring human survival. It did insure the dominance of those with the best fighting skills and weapons. It’s true enough society won’t evolve overnight. How long do you expect women to wait for men to outgrow their fantasy of superiority?

Here’s something interesting from a recent article in Scientific American

But why the overall female preference for, “redder blues.” Ling speculates it harks back to hunter-gatherer societies. “The female, as gatherer, had to pick reddish fruits against green leafy backgrounds, therefore a preference for red against green may have benefited their food gathering and thus gained them evolutionary advantage,” she says. “Evolution may also drive females to prefer redder faces (male faces are ruddier than female faces across all races). A reddish face often [means] good health; this may be a good cue to help the females to select mates.”

28. Anonymous - August 31, 2007

Really, I’m telling you from the bottom of my great anonymous woman heart that this is not a political campaing to destroy you. This is, as you said, for the lulz. An internet joke, not an IRL thing.

I don’t agree with radical feminists because it’s stupid to stop racism with racism, it doesn’t work that way, if you keep criticizing everything men do, you are stupid. We should co-exist as HUMAN BEINGS not as “women” and “men”. WE ARE ONE.

And in all seriousness the sad but true fact is that the ones who degrade a women more than anything, are women themselves.

/end of post

29. Anonymous - August 31, 2007

gb2/kitchen/ and make me a sammich woman!

30. angryscientist - September 1, 2007

Who’s trying to stop racism with racism, or sexism with sexism? Radical feminists get such a bad rap. Men do an awful lot of horrible things to women, and the planet, not to mention other men. There’s no shortage of things to criticize, but it’s a gross exaggeration to say radfems criticize everything men do. Some men save lives. Others do other things of value. It isn’t so black and white. It’s true some women hurt other women, and radical feminists are keenly aware of that, being on the receiving end more often than not.

Commenter 29, how original. Too bad you couldn’t come up with anything intelligent to say. Or was that supposed to be funny? Maybe to your cronies, it is, but to me it’s pathetic.

31. Anonymous - September 5, 2007

This is done for the lulz. There is no political purpose.

Well… at least for the most part. Nobody truly controls ebaumsworld…. Let me spell it out for you. This is how to get trolled by Anonymous(and how radfems fit in).

1. Have absolutely no sense of reality. Radfems assume 50% of the population are potential rapists, and that they were Almost Raped every time they see a man.

2. Inflate the importance of your cause, or exaggerate your “hardships”. Radfems see themselves as some sort of crusaders against the evils of men. In their world, they are constantly under the threat of impalement by the meat-spear, and will not be freed from the shackles of oppression till all men renounce their penii.

3. Take the internet seriously. Yeah, I know. The internet is serious business. In fact, Nobody has ever made anything up ever in the history evar. SRSLY!!! If it is typed on a webpage somewhere, it is GUARANTEED to happen. The only defense is to get all butthurt about it. But the radfems don’t usually do this. O WAIT, they do!

4. Be a lolcow. If anybody says something bad about you, write massive amounts of batshit insane ranting. Better if it makes no logical sense whatsoever, or in some way advocates violence. Wishing you aborted your own kid because he looks at porn is a good start. I’m suuuure if a daughter tried to get some makeup or clothes there’s no way she could afford on her own, you would wish you had aborted her, for the potential exploitation of some future husband…. o wait, she wouldn’t. (see 1)

on comment 30… Anonymous does not try to *stop* anything, just generate lulz. If something is stopped, it is merely a side effect of the lulz. Anonymous does not side with “good” or “evil”.

tl;dr
trolling feminazis = epic lulz

32. James - September 5, 2007

Why is it, that you claim women mature faster, when in fact, the same guys you diss when you are 20ish are the same ones you wish you have married when you are 40ish and divorced, with three kids? Do you honestly think that these guys should still want you 20 years later with all that baggage, even after you rejected them? I only wish I could say that there has only been one female that has done this to me, but I can’t honestly say that at all. It seems all my old female friends now find me attractive and want me to support their family, when I actually attempted that so many years ago, but that wasn’t good enough then.

It never is good enough. Ingrateful human beings. The grass WILL ALWAYS BE GREENER WITH WOMEN.

33. James - September 5, 2007

You women tear down men, break their confidence, and laugh the entire time, and you wonder why is it that men turn out to be assholes? Even though I can laugh about myself, I still get offended the same as you when a women jokes about my insecurites. It’s no fucking different than me saying a woman is one dog ugly bitch, or a slut who would fuck anyone, or she’s just a money hungry whore.

You are half the problem, and if you refuse to see that, than we both are fucked, aren’t we? Oh no, it’s much easier to throw off off your problems on men, pointing your fingers, and claiming your reasons and excuses as being justification for your careless ideals/actions. Yes, us men are the real reason you complain about us all the time. Yes, it’s all OUR fault you are so UNHAPPY. HATE MOAR. Hell, I might turn gay after reading this site.

34. angryscientist - September 5, 2007

Who has absolutely no sense of reality? Radfems? Considering the caliber of these comments, I think that’s either some kind of macabre joke, or pure projection. Why do I say that? Because you guys have too much trouble either with reality, or reading comprehension!

Commenter 31 likes to exaggerate, or make things up. Nobody feels “they were Almost Raped every time they see a man.” If he were to say, every time a man leers at them, that’d bear some resemblance to reality. The freedom from oppression women seek has absolutely nothing to do with men renouncing their penises, but if men were to renounce acting like dickheads and their fantasies of superiority, that’d be a different story, wouldn’t it? Maybe this guy equates that prospect with castration, or emasculation?

Just because the Internet may be loaded with fools making things up doesn’t mean everything on the Internet is bogus. Anyone wanting to make that argument might as well say everything in any form of media is bogus. Why should newspapers have web sites, if nothing on the Internet should be taken seriously?

That last part of comment 31 makes no sense at all. Comment 30 was mine, containing my response to commenter 28 saying she doesn’t “agree with radical feminists because it’s stupid to stop racism with racism.” Obviously I wasn’t referring to Anonymous trying to stop anything. Is this careless reading, or more of his disconnection from reality? At least this commenter cops to a small part of the purpose behind these attacks being political. Get real, guy. Your sense of humor is political, and not in some insignificant way. Maybe you don’t realize how well your antics serve the purposes of the men’s rights bozos. In the context of the constant attacks on feminists this kind of practical joke can’t be reduced to merely a matter of lulz. That might be your intention, but it isn’t the reality. Actions generally have unintended consequences as well as intended.

I don’t know what to say to James, since he hasn’t figured out this blogger is a man. If he wants to complain about women here, that’s one thing, but I think he understands the English language well enough to know he shouldn’t be referring to women as you on a man’s blog. My argument is my way of defending women’s right to free speech. His rants have nothing to do with me, so what’s with all these second person pronouns? I know English is a bit different in the UK (where he lives, judging by his e-mail), but not to that extent. When women have equivalent power and authority in this world, I might agree they are half the problem. Meanwhile, I must conclude James also has problems with reality, reading comprehension, or both. He might turn gay after reading what another man has to say? What kind of stupid joke is that?

35. Enough, little girls - September 11, 2007

It is pointless to argue.

I have read all of this comments here and have come up with a short couple things to say

1. Rape victims are listened to more than the accused. But rapes are also rarely convicted. Why? He said so himself: not very many women actually report they’ve been raped.

There are truths to both of those facts, but it is pointless to pin one or the other down as /the/ truth.

2. Anonymous is made up of people from all demographics, races, genders, and beliefs. If you don’t want to raid, don’t raid. By raiding, you agree to put your individual beliefs aside to act as a whole, a ‘legion’ if yo will. If one soldier in an army doesn’t like the opposing side more than everyone else, he fights clouded by his rage and, in the end, dies because he didn’t work with his comrades. Anticipating an argument, one could say that this hatred can fuel their fighting ability, but MORE OFTEN THAN NOT the soldier die foolishly.

That having been said, if any Anon’s hate feminists more than the rest, they do things to them on their own time. But, as a whole, Anon is only in it for the lulz(a corruption of lol).

In short, Neuromancer is right

3. This is to all anons that may look at this: IT’S OVER. NO MORE LULZ. GB/2/ GAIA IF YOUR STILL AROUND

36. Tits McGee - December 5, 2007

Angry,

So you’re a scientist? Then why would you claim that women can build up their strength to mens level with training? It is common knowledge that this is malarkey(read about muscle anabolism). Suffice to say, if i was a woman in idaho i would hold the female bench press record, and im not hulking.

Honestly i wonder why you are so concerned with women. Men are shoved into categories, and are called fags(or much worse) if they dont meet rather narrow criteria in many cases. I don’t know exactly what you believe but the sexes are not equal, individuals aren’t equal, and nobody is entitled to anything. What is right and wrong is nothing more than your preference…it just so happens many people have similar preferences.

Many women give men reason to be angry at them, and many women are attracted to the sort of men they later complain about.

It’s obvious that these extreme fem movements are spurred on by women who have been terribly abused, and they just arent realistic. Theyre highly emotional..really out of control. For a fem to say she wished she aborted her son after she saw him watching porn is unforgivable. He’s a person now. In my opinion if she ever says anything like that to him or loves him less due to his origins she should be raped again and again and again. But i recognize that as an opinion, unlike the foolish fems who think theyre magically entitled to the world they want. What many of them need is therapy and lots of love.

You are highly biased and your numerous long responses demonstrate nothing.

37. angryscientist - December 5, 2007

Hey, asshole, you’re a perfect example of why feminism is important. She should be raped again and again and again? Gee, sounds just like pornography, sans the bribe! I guess you think both are perfectly AOK, just what women deserve if they don’t fit your picture of a virtuous woman! You are one sick puppy in this sick society. Yes, women have been terribly abused, by men who think just like you!

What is right and wrong is nothing more than personal preference, huh? Postmodern nihilistic crap. No wonder you think this mother deserves to be raped. I could say lots more, but I’d rather not waste my time.

38. Amazed - February 14, 2008

Well, I am a scientist as well. I’m a microbiologist and an M.D. I heard about this situation and have been looking into some radical feminsm blogs and whatnot, and am simply appalled at the nature of what is said. It is generally the same overblown generalizations and falsehoods repeated ad nauseum. There is a lot of talk about a patriarchy that exists in their minds and their minds only, hate speech, etc. It is really quite disturbing. However, the overlying theme in all of them is a refusal to listen to an opposing view and, when said views are proposed, they are immediately danced around and rejected, with little or no data or truth to back up their claims. Yours is no better. Shame on you. Scientists are meant to seek the truth, not cloud it. Scientists provide data and facts to back up their statements, not falsehoods and opinions. Radical feminism does nothing to promote equality and to say it does is a blatant lie. In fact, most of your statements in regards to these comments is strikingly similar to what every other radical feminist says in response to an opposing view. I have compared it to the KKK in other conversations, and I see that as fitting. There is no acceptance of opposing views, and men are seen as dredges on society. Your responses here have been laughable at best. They started off as very obtuse. Rather than truly answer the questions or opinions others were putting forth, you merely blew them off and stated that only your opinions mattered (perhaps you didn’t say it, but it was clear from your responses that’s how you felt). Any opinion other than your own was met with, basically, “Where did you come up with that? You’re wrong (insert vague, opinionated reason they’re wrong here). This is the truth (insert made-up truth here). This is dangerous. Still, I don’t know why I expected any different. All radical feminists act the same way. It’s quite bland, really. Perhaps the movement would actually bear any weight at all if someone stood out from the pack? Perhaps if someone actually DID something this would make a difference, rather than hiding behind a computer and blindly disregarding any other view but your own? Again, this is a dangerous practice. I would equate it with muslim extremist behavior. Granted, no one has been blown up, but the ways the ideologies are held… well, frighteningly similar. Of course later on, you reacted much more childishly, using lame insults and a more harsh and cynical tone, combined with even more cloaked “wisdom”. I know none of this will make any difference, and your response will simply be that I am incorrect because you say so and you will misconstrue what I’m saying and instead of arguing what I’m actually saying in my sentences you will try to make it seem like I was saying something else and argue that instead. That seems to be a common practice both with you and other radical feminists. I only wish to say that if you are indeed a scientist you should be ashamed of the way you’ve handled yourself and the way you put forth your views. That is from a true scientist. And for the record, I support women, I have a lovely wife who fully agrees with my sentiments (and no, not out of fear, she’s just as strong willed as me if not stronger). Perhaps it is time to drop the falsehoods and the life of anger and embrace a life of happiness and togetherness. Of course, I disagree with you, so I’m wrong. Good-bye.

BTW, others have stated the reason for the attacks just fine. Number 26 actually did just fine before you decided to instantly tear down his comments by using more garbage tactics, bouncing around his ideas and stating that he’s wrong… pure and simple… without actually answering him. It’s no attack on feminism, just nutjobs that can produce laughs. They do the same to tons of men on youtube, livejournal, etc. Are they anti-men as well? To act as though this is further proof that women are oppressed is simply laughable. Do some research first, then attempt to open up a discussion about something you clearly know nothing about. Or better yet, think about another side of an issue for once, open your mind of to other possibilities.

39. angryscientist - February 15, 2008

a patriarchy that exists in their minds and their minds only

Are we living on the same planet? Have you seen some of the tripe thrown at Hillary Clinton? I don’t like her policies much, since she reminds me too much of her husband, but do you seriously think this has nothing to do with sexism? You may be a scientist. So is Lawrence Summers, formerly president of Harvard. Scientists can be as blind as bats to their own arrogant biases. This is why we have nuclear power, genetically engineered crops, dead zones in rivers and seas, and a planet covered with persistent poisons. Sigmund Freud was a scientist as well, but his theories about women were pure BS. I know far more about feminism than you think I do, enough to know it’d be absurd for me to claim to be a radical feminist. Some who call themselves radical feminists do in fact hate men, even men like me. I’d agree those particular women don’t promote equality; they seem to think it’s impossible. However, radical feminists are as diverse as any other group. Maybe you should be more circumspect about claiming people you disagree with are singleminded, dismissive of evidence, and ignorant.

All radical feminists act the same way.

Now that’s funny. Your experience of radical feminists must be quite limited, or else your definition doesn’t match theirs. If you said, all man-haters act the same way, that’d be closer to the truth. Any scientist worth his or her salt knows the word all rarely applies to human behavior. One size fits all? Does it really? Care to define radical feminist? Radical feminists can’t even agree on a definition. Why should a man’s scornful view of feminism, radical or otherwise, deserve any credence at all?

40. Nope - March 9, 2008

These morons aren’t destroying anything, it’s just the internet equivalent of graffiti. So someone writes nasty letters and forces you to learn how to take care of your server. So the fuck what?

God, you take yourself seriously.

Also (the mother’s) attitude is fucking harmful to her son. He shouldn’t have to fear that his sexuality is evil.

If he hears that someone is offended by his Mom’s misandrony, that might just put his mind at ease.

41. angryscientist - March 11, 2008

Graffiti, huh? Heart did put her hacked board back up, but some stuff is missing. I don’t know what happened to it, but I suspect some of the damage couldn’t be repaired. So easy for a man to say, so what. If the shoe were on the other foot, you might be singing a different tune. Do you think death threats are funny? The law says different, but cowards like to hide behind anonymity.

Personally, this was just an annoyance. I was a minor target, and this blog was never downed by the attacks; I merely had to turn on comment moderation. The BS directed at me was just stupid, not threatening. This wasn’t about me, so why this about me taking myself seriously?

42. Anonymous - March 26, 2008

“I’d be interested in any explanation of why a self-respecting man would stoop to such tactics preventing women from having their say in a safe space.”

Sexist. There are plenty of women in /b/ and Anonymous. Assuming that they are male is equally what you are trying to fight against, no?

“I know, most guys think this is harmless, but I have to disagree. Women are raped, battered, harassed, terrorized, or worse on a routine basis. ”

So are guys. And guys are unlikely to report it as well because it isn’t “manly” to be beat up or attacked by a female. It is also underrated.

“because she fears her son will learn women are fair game to rape, batter, humiliate? Is that not what most porn is all about these days?”

That follows the same logic that the PTC uses to censor TV shows and video games. You are basing the idea that people will rape because they watch it when most people who actually do watch it don’t do that. I would bet that these people (male or female as both can do it) would do it anyway without having the porn. I don’t by the “Playing a video game will make you a killer.” Sounds like bullshit with the number of people who actually do it and don’t become like that.

“She didn’t specify what kind of porn she caught her son viewing”

We will always support our /b/rother’s desire to watch porn. And his mother saying that she wish she could have killed him before just because he watched a few things of porn is unbelievable. Obviously there are a good portion of young boys who are generally upset by this as they can see themselves in this position.

“Is threatening rape and murder funny? It is criminal, by the way, anonymous or not. ”

Tough one. US has pretty good free speech laws. And not all of those in the raid are from the US so they would need to look at local laws. You act as if this is just a US group.

“Isn’t your real beef with the law, or the empire? ”

We follow no laws. They are for meatspacefags.

“No political motives? Could have fooled me. What do you call shutting down feminist discussion, apolitical funnies? Be that as it may, you guys really ought to give this mother a break. If you think porn should be available to teenagers, even just tame stuff, you have a beef with the law.”

Law doesn’t apply to anonymous. You make the mistake that everyone is from America which is wrong. It is apolitical funnies as well as stopping our /b/rother from being censored by his mother.

43. angryscientist - March 26, 2008

Hmm. Men’s rights propaganda? Are you arguing the numbers of men being raped, battered, harassed, terrorized, or worse is anywhere near comparable to the numbers of women? If you are, wake up. It isn’t even close, and the perpetrators are overwhelmingly male, either way.

Are you arguing pornography has no link to rape? It may not cause men to rape directly, but the evidence that it increases the motivation to rape is overwhelming. Why would men enjoy looking at gonzo porn, if not to feed their vicious resentments toward women?

I’m not assuming anything about everyone in Anonymous, not their sex nor their nationality. My impression is that it’s mostly American males, but the actual proportions, I’ve no idea. Why would it matter?

Anonymous didn’t do this to stop a mother from censoring her son. That might have been seen as a justification, but they must have known that wouldn’t be the result. They would’ve had to kidnap the boy. Getting upset is no excuse for vandalism or death threats, especially for a group supposedly all about free speech! Free speech is about rational debate, not a swarm of angry bees crudely forcing opponents off the web!

44. Anonymous - March 29, 2008

“Hmm. Men’s rights propaganda? Are you arguing the numbers of men being raped, battered, harassed, terrorized, or worse is anywhere near comparable to the numbers of women? If you are, wake up. It isn’t even close, and the perpetrators are overwhelmingly male, either way.”

You know this how? Reports? Ever think that a man might be scared to report because it would make him look weak and “unmasculine” in a hyper-masculine society? Wake up, it happens to everyone, not just females.

Anyway, it is a moot point since no one actually committed any of said crimes. So, yeah, it happens to people. But Anonymous committed none of them.

“Are you arguing pornography has no link to rape? It may not cause men to rape directly, but the evidence that it increases the motivation to rape is overwhelming. Why would men enjoy looking at gonzo porn, if not to feed their vicious resentments toward women?”

Does playing a shooting game make people kill people? No. People are able to tell the difference between reality and fiction. It is only a select few who do it and they are already disturbed which is why they are drawn to that material.

“I’m not assuming anything about everyone in Anonymous, not their sex nor their nationality. My impression is that it’s mostly American males, but the actual proportions, I’ve no idea. Why would it matter?”

Your buying into stereotypes and sexist ones at that. I know more females than males who go to /b/. Your assumptions are based on what you think a male or female would like. You have no clue but still claim that you believe for who knows what reason that they are mostly male. “Males act x and females act y so I am saying I believe these people are males.” That doesn’t scream sexism to you?

“Anonymous didn’t do this to stop a mother from censoring her son. That might have been seen as a justification, but they must have known that wouldn’t be the result. They would’ve had to kidnap the boy. Getting upset is no excuse for vandalism or death threats, especially for a group supposedly all about free speech! Free speech is about rational debate, not a swarm of angry bees crudely forcing opponents off the web!”

Anonymous is making their point the same way they do with everything else. Censorship is wrong and we won’t stand for it. Church of Scientology tried censoring Youtube and look what happened to them. They also got attacked. It is about free speech and sometimes you need to stand up and fight fire with fire to make your point. They stepped over the line first, we just respond.

45. angryscientist - March 31, 2008

FemAnon – August 16, 2007

Lol, copypasta.

How much of Anonymous is female? I saw a 20% figure once…but it would probably depend on the chan, the topic, and who felt like telling the truth that day.

Should I believe you, or the female who commented here? Care to tell me and/or my readers what /b/ stands for?

Your argument about men being unwilling to report is straight up men’s rights propaganda. I happen to know a fair bit about those folks. Do you?

Gonzo porn is extremely popular, and it’s far more than a select few men who rape and batter women, unless those select few are raping and battering scores of women each! You can deny there is a link, but saying porn doesn’t cause rape is not the same as there being no link. That’s like saying because the flu bug doesn’t make everyone exposed to it sick, it doesn’t cause the flu! To deny there’s a link between the influenza virus and influenza is so absurd, I bet even you wouldn’t try to make that argument! It’s not a perfect analogy, because exposure to the virus is required to get the flu, whereas exposure to porn isn’t required to motivate rape. My point is, vicious imagery encourages vicious behavior, not that it forces vicious behavior, just like exposure to the flu virus inclines one to get the flu, but many people are able to resist.

You have a very strange idea of stepping over the line and fighting fire with fire. Free speech is about a free exchange of ideas, not shutting down web sites! I guess just like the law, logic means nothing to you folks either! Anonymous may not have committed any actual rapes or battering, but sure as hell let loose with the threats. You can say there was no harassment or terrorizing, but just because you don’t see it that way doesn’t mean those you harassed, terrorized, and vandalized should agree with your interpretation of your deeds. Why do you call it raep?

46. anónimo - June 1, 2008

What /b/ stands for?
/b/ stands for?
/b/ stands
/b/

/b/ stands for nothing at all
You were trolled, and you fed the trolls with delicious drama.

47. Clarence - December 28, 2008

I know you are not likely to read this after such a long time, but this mother (ed) didn’t just wish she had aborted her son. She claimed she knew he would grow up to be a rapist/abuser of women because of the porn consumption. Thus her hatred of his father was transferred to him. This is sick parenting no matter how you look at it, and there is absolutely no defense for it.

Quite frankly, the nuttiness involved in some radical feminist beliefs mirrors that of many a religion. Of course Heart was a quiverfull…

48. angryscientist - December 29, 2008

You jump to a lot of conclusions, Clarence. You don’t know what the boy was looking at. You don’t know what was going through her head when she saw it. Which radical femnist beliefs do you think are nutty or resemble religion? Funny, I always thought feminism was about women having minds of their own. Heart sued religious leaders and left them behind, after discovering they couldn’t handle her having a mind of her own. It seems some of those guys can’t handle Sarah Palin having a mind of her own, either, though Palin is no radical.


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